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   24/07/2008, 5:06 PM
Scaramouche is not online. Last active: 17/05/2008 10:36:57 Scaramouche



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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
 gardener wrote:

I know I wrote to him once about the road surface on the Stalham bypass which produces more "mirage" shimmer than any road I have seen and I wondered if it contributed to all the bike accidents?



Not nearly as many methinks, as by looking up whilst driving to wonder at the great silver bird in the sky.


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   24/07/2008, 11:18 PM
gardener is not online. Last active: 23/10/2008 18:11:27 gardener

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Wink [;)] Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
 Lionheart wrote:

Note it is Gardener not gamekeeper...

Without recapitulating that tiresome tome, I believe - if memory serves - you will find that the randy gamekeeper diddling his better was originally an under-gardener, before becoming an over-gamekeeper.

Well I will defer to you on that since I have not picked up any Lawrence since the early seventies and the last thing I can be a£$+d to do right now is to plough through that particular volume to prove you wrong or right!


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   25/07/2008, 7:06 AM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
Theres enough diddling going on in the dunes at Waxham Gardener without getting your book out or anything else out.I have heard of the Lincolnshire Poacher but not a Norfolk Diddler.Keith and myself live a more sheltered life.John
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   25/07/2008, 7:38 AM
gardener is not online. Last active: 23/10/2008 18:11:27 gardener

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Embarrassed [:$] Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.

 john wrote:
Theres enough diddling going on in the dunes at Waxham Gardener without getting your book out or anything else out.I have heard of the Lincolnshire Poacher but not a Norfolk Diddler.Keith and myself live a more sheltered life.John

Haha-

You are right John, because adders aren't the only things you might walk upon accidentally!

Lovely morning here. Some horrendous cases of sunburn in grockles in town yesterday-the cooling sea breeze must have fooled 'em.


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   25/07/2008, 8:55 AM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
Grockles,Gardener!!! Please enlighten me. Hope its not a descease you get from dangling your diddler.I wonder how many have been caught with a adders tail instead of a diddler.Theres a sting in every tail.John.
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   25/07/2008, 9:16 AM
gardener is not online. Last active: 23/10/2008 18:11:27 gardener

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.

I believe grockle is an import from Cornwall/Devon and is used to refer to the more obvious non resident, often identified when spotted in the town centre/Marks/Palmers by the bare upper body, saggy shorts and red markings on the face and torso or in cooler weather by shirts in vertical black and white stripes or other non native patterns. The hen is usually similarly dressed and coloured red but mostly wears off the shoulder strappy T shirts with the saggy shorts.The strident calls of both can be heard from a distance along with those of their young. They are not dangerous but can be inconvenient because of their habit of barging through queues, standing around in groups looking gormless, accidentally drifting out to sea and in the case of the young males being inebriated by 2 o'clock. Mostly confined to coastal areas where they frequent habitats such as the Pub on The Prom,Troll Cart, Harry Ramsden's and the Pleasure Beach. At the latter they may be seen regurgitating what they consumed earlier at their feeding grounds.

 

 


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   25/07/2008, 11:24 AM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
We have got loads of them here Gardener.We are just waiting for the sea to breach the defences and then we will organise bus trips to sunny Norfolk and drop them off at Horsey Mill.The R.S.P.B.can then quite rightly say they are trying to save a endangered species.John
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   27/07/2008, 7:48 AM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
Keith,you have more brains than me.Have you read the report on the BBC/NORFOLK/NEWS re gravel extraction at sea and the link to coastal erosion? It would now appear that the group who are against gravel extraction have scientific evidence that this does cause coastal erosion.I just wondered how serious this is and what effect it has on the Norfolk Coast.John
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   27/07/2008, 10:47 AM
keith gerrard is not online. Last active: 17/11/2008 20:45:40 keith gerrard



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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.

I certainly would not say I have more brains than you john.

IMO the answer should be obvious, if you take the sea bed away and it is not completely replaced the result must be erosion.

The coast line of Norfolk is measurably retreating, so this must PROVE that what is taken away is not completely replaced.

Fact.


Dream on

keithgerrard@gerrard24.freeserve.co.uk


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   27/07/2008, 2:20 PM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
So if I have got this right Keith.Where the sea bed is removed it is then partly replenished with sand from the shore line! How the hell did they get a licence to cause such a disaster.John
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   27/07/2008, 8:00 PM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
Gardener.If you should come across a Yorkshire grockle by the name of Paul H.on holiday in the Wroxham area,do us all a favour,buy him a pint to shut him up.John
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   28/07/2008, 8:25 PM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
According to BBC/Norfolk,there is to be a massive protest at Southwold on Wednesday re coastal defences.What is the betting Gordan Brown will be elsewhere.I just hope he gets the welcome he deserves wherever he goes.John
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   29/07/2008, 11:29 PM
Pat and Norma Gowen is not online. Last active: 25/08/2008 13:30:17 Pat and Norma Gowen

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.

The knowledge that the exploitation of our coastal sand and shingle creates coastal erosion is not new as has been implied.

One hundred years ago, the British Government set up the Royal Commission on Coastal Erosion "...to reach some conclusion with regard to the amount of land which has been lost in recent years by the encroachment of the sea on the coasts of the United Kingdom...". The Minutes of this appeared in 1908 and 1909, and the Final Report in 1911)expressed concern that removal of such sand and gravel caused or accelerated coastal land loss.

Following the loss to the sea of the village of Hallsands due to dredging for aggregate for the Devonport Dockyard, there then followed bitter arguments about the effects of extraction and how both the Government and the dredging contractors responded to land and property losses. The Government responded by setting up this Royal Commission on Coastal Erosion, following on the practice that Royal Commissions were established to inquire publicly about very important issues of national concern. It commenced work in 1907 and presented its Final Report in 1911. It was required to inquire and report:

"As to the encroachment of the sea on various parts of the Coast of the United Kingdom and the damage which has been or is likely to be caused thereby; and what measures are desirable for the prevention of such damage".

It further considered what powers were needed for protection and if changes to the law were merited. The Royal Commission Final Report (1911 p.158) concluded:

  "The removal of materials from many parts of the shores of the Kingdom and the dredging of material from below low water mark, have resulted in much erosion on neighbouring parts of the coast" and that "Removal of sediments from the shore should be illegal" (Para. 7(a) p.160).

The Final Report (1911, Part II) said that on the basis of foreshore losses "the gradient of the foreshore must be becoming steeper." (p.45). However, there was no recognition by the authorities of the implications. More recently, Taylor et al (2004) report that 61% of the coastline was steepening and 33% had flattened. This recognition, long before the onset of Global Warming, is critical to the debate about coastal changes, especially in the discussion of sand-mining impacts, as it indicates a progressive exposure of beaches to serious damage.

Despite the extensive damage to the English North Sea Coast in 1953, the Waverley Committee on Coastal Flooding (1954) failed to comment on this, but merely noted an increasing frequency of severe storms. However it stressed that research into the movements of beach material, offshore sand banks and related coastal problems was urgent (Summary of Recommendations Para. 114 -(3), p.28). 

Empirical research 20 years ago by the American Corps of Engineers proved that dredging a total of less than two million tonnes of sand over a four year period 14 miles from the coast of Cape Canaveral brought about massive erosion of previously accreting beaches forty miles away. Vastly more than this has been dredged olff Great Yarmouth as close as within 3 miles of the coastline.

 

Many similar scientific papers evidencing the coastal impact of offshore aggregate dredging can be found on our MARINET website by visiting www.marinet.org.uk. These include the EUROSION Report indicating the offshore dredging cause of the erosion of the North Norfolk Coast, and the more recent 'Sandpit Report' by a large group of international expert scientists describing the mechanism as to how this is brought about.

 

But as the Crown Estate and the Treasury have gained over 1.3 billion pounds as Royalties and on VAT imposed from offshore off Great Yarmouth alone over the past fourteen years, no doubt the dredging companies even more, they are never likely to admit to the cause of the threat now facing Norfolk. If they did admit to the basic cause just imagine the claims for reimbursement and compensation that would result !

 

Thegovernment bodies only accept the claims made of 'no impact upon the shoreline' made in the Impact Assesments created for the licence applications, all of which are unhesitatingly passed by the government, These IA's are created by companies selected, appointed by and paid for by the dredging organisations themselves.  The government adviser is the head of one of these companies.

 

Thus, our erosion and the dredging is likely to continue unabated, as vested interest and big money is at stake here.

 

And has it been considered that the Shoreline Management Plan, 'Managed Retreat' and 'Making Room for Water' is basically the means of liberating more sand and shingle from our beaches, sand cliffs and dunes to aid and abet continuity of a reducing source ?

 

Pat Gowen,  MARINET & NSAG


Pat Gowen
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   30/07/2008, 6:53 AM
john is not online. Last active: 31/10/2008 06:34:18 john

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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
Thanks for such a detailed posting "Norma".It has certainly opened my eyes and no doubt a lot of other peoples eyes.It would appear that we are back on the subject again of where a government advisor has vested interest in his/her report.We have got DEFRA and Natural England submitting similar reports.Where do we go from here? John
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   30/07/2008, 10:13 AM
keith gerrard is not online. Last active: 17/11/2008 20:45:40 keith gerrard



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Re: R.S.P.B.Broads report.
Green Peace Warrior anchored next to the dredgers?

Dream on

keithgerrard@gerrard24.freeserve.co.uk


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